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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2013-08-13 City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 1 of 43 August 13, 2013 ZONING BOARD OF APPEALS CITY OF LIVONIA MINUTES OF A REGULAR MEETING HELD AUGUST 13, 2013 A Regular Meeting of the Zoning Board of Appeals of the City of Livonia was held in the Auditorium of the Livonia City Hall on Tuesday, August 13, 2013. MEMBERS PRESENT: Matthew Henzi, Chairman Sam Caramagno, Secretary Ed Duggan, Jr. Elizabeth H. McCue Kathleen McIntyre Robert E. Sills MEMBERS ABSENT: Craig Pastor OTHERS PRESENT: Michael Fisher, Assistant City Attorney Scott Kearfott, City Inspector Bonnie J. Murphy, Court Reporter, CSR-2300, CER-2300 The meeting was called to order at 7:00 p.m. Chairman Henzi then explained the Rules of Procedure to those interested parties. Each petitioner must give their name and address and declare hardship for appeal. Appeals of the Zoning Board's decisions are made to the Wayne County Circuit Court. The Chairman advised the audience that appeals can be filed within 21 days of the date tonight’s minutes are approved. The decision of the Zoning Board shall become final within five (5) calendar days following the hearing and the applicant shall be mailed a copy of the decision. There are four decisions the Board can make: to deny, to grant, to grant as modified by the Board, or to table for further information. Each petitioner may ask to be heard by a full seven (7) member Board. Six (6) members were present this evening. The Chairman asked if anyone wished to be heard by a full Board and no one wished to do so. The Secretary then read the Agenda and Legal Notice to each appeal, and each petitioner indicated their presence. Appeals came up for hearing after due legal notice was given to all interested parties within 300 feet, petitioners and City Departments. There were 35 people present in the audience. (7:05) City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 2 of 43 August 13, 2013 APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-31: Northridge LLC, on behalf of lessee Kroger of Michigan, on the south side of Eight Mile (33797), between Gill and Farmington, seeking to install an electronic fuel price sign upon a fuel pump canopy which is not allowed. This type of sign must be placed on a conforming ground sign. Henzi: Mr. Kearfoot, anything to add to this case? Kearfott: Not at this time. Henzi: Any questions for the Inspection Department? Caramagno: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: Are there any other signs on canopies anywhere in the city? Kearfott: From my understanding, no. Caramagno: This will be the first one in Livonia? Kearfott: Yes, that’s what I was told. Caramagno: Thank you. Henzi: Any other questions? Hearing none, will the Petitioner or representative come to the table? Petitioner: Certainly. Good evening. Henzi: Good evening. Petitioner: Can I distribute this before I sit down? Henzi; Sure. Petitioner: The top photograph was taken this morning, for your references. Henzi: Your name and address? Petitioner: Matthew Pisko, 33704 Hills Tech Drive, Farmington Hills, Michigan. Henzi: Mr. Pisko, tell us why you’re proposing the fuel sign on the canopy? Petitioner: Well, as the top photograph will show, when you leave the Kroger store, you can’t see the price sign from the street. That price sign that is shown on the canopy, it is by far one of the most important elements of the Kroger fuel center is people going to the grocery store, they accumulate points and they see that price sign when they City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 3 of 43 August 13, 2013 leave. In my original packet, the one, the full sized plans you guys received, I put a ring of radiuses around the fuel station to show as you move aware from the fuel station just how many hundred feet that sign is away from Eight Mile. And the second page of the color renderings is a photographic depiction of what that signage is for. It really is of no purpose with 10-inch numerals at 45 miles an hour to anyone on Eight Mile and a none too subtle distinction as you read the record of the petition. This is not an electronic sign in the sense that I think it’s being represented. If you can think of it as placards, flat metal placards with a white numeral with a black background on what essentially would be a barrel akin to a slot machine. So when they change prices, it will literally click to the number and then it stays there, it’s not changing, it’s not brightly illuminated, it’s not digital, it’s a fixed metal panel as is the price sign on the street that’s not visible from the store. Kroger’s fuel station as you’re well aware it’s brand new. Some of the things that occurred, this sign was on the planning sign all the way through, there was not any deficiency letters. We might have changed what we laid out if this wasn’t part of the project because it’s so critical to our business. I’m sure you all remember, I live in Livonia, too. There’s an enormous monument sign that is in the middle of the lot that we could have retained for signage if we would have not been able to have this as an option, the perceived option. When Mr. Taormina said Matthew, you can’t have that there, the canopy was ordered with a notch already and we went into panic mode. This fuel station is really different from a traditional gas station as far as hardships. The bulk regulations and where it’s centered in the road is really kind of unique to our business, self created, yes, we created the station but we complied. This is the only variance we’re requesting so from a bulk regulation standpoint we really did hit the nail on the head as far as everything else and are asking relief. We don’t think it’s injurious to anyone else. It’s only proposed on the left side which directly faces the patrons as they leave the store so they can make an informed decision. I know it may seem like a short time span from driving on Eight Mile to see the sign and grocery shopping, I can’t remember what I said 20 seconds ago so I appreciate this sign on the canopy as well. Henzi: I’m sure we’ll have some questions, I have one or two. As I understand it, the intent isn’t to attract the attention of anyone driving on Eight Mile, it’s to let your Kroger customers know once they leave the store, hey, I better get gas right there, and that’s the intent, right? Petitioner: Beyond a shadow of a doubt that is the most important purpose. In the pecking order of signs on the canopy for Kroger, that would be the last one that Kroger would allow us to omit, it is by far the most important. And let me say this, if the canopy was turned 90 degrees and the Kroger store was where the gym was, no one could see it from Eight Mile or any other road. It’s that important. Henzi: Okay. Any questions for the Petitioner? Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: I’m confused by your plans. How many signs are you asking for? City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 4 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: Just a singular price sign. Duggan: Just this one sign? Petitioner: That one price sign and I have to tell you from the time that plan was shown to the Planning Commission and City Council, it’s actually been reduced by nine square feet. We reduced the size so it’s even smaller to make it that much more palatable. The original sign was 3’6” high by 8’8”. This sign that we’re proposing --- and that had 18-inch fonts which was the same font that’s on the monument sign out front. What we’re proposing now in that photograph is 2’6” high and the font kit is 10 inches tall, so the numerals are actually reduced from 18 to 10 which makes it virtually, I can tell you it’s useless from Eight Mile if the concern is the sign. Duggan: So then you won’t have another sign on the other side of canopy? Petitioner: No, we’re not proposing it. Duggan: All right, got it. Thank you. Henzi: Any other questions? Caramagno: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: What other options did you consider or has Kroger considered for customers leaving that store knowing what a fuel price is walking out of that lobby or either lobby, isn’t there two? Petitioner: There’s two. The main entrance is the main entrance. There’s an auxiliary entrance that isn’t used as frequently. If you drove past the store you might have seen there’s a triangle sign, I don’t even know if that’s in compliance but that is a different price, that’s a price for what a Kroger shopper that carries a Kroger fob or card would get. So that’s the discounted price already. We can’t advertise the discounted price on a canopy because that’s a class of trade issue, so the price on the canopy is the street price. So what Speedway would be charging or what our monument sign would be charging, same as they would be doing. And then if they’ve accumulated points through cross merchandising and shopping in a store, then they would get that, they would learn what that is at the pump. Caramagno: Isn’t there an option, isn’t there an ability to grab them before they leave the store either at the register or that little lobby as they’re walking out that door that’s in their face as opposed to --- you know this sign, although you’re attracting your people walking out of the store, it’s not highly visible from Eight Mile Road, there’s no doubt about it and if it were, it’s only one direction. And you know it’s going to start a trend here in the City. And I realize yours is a little unique but it sure seems like you’ve got an opportunity walking out of the store to advertise fuel price for customers, Kroger City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 5 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: In all honesty I can tell you Kroger has 1,400 of these across the country, they have 500 freestanding convenient stores. Having this fuel station in the expanse of a lot, they’ve tried every manner of advertising in the store. This is the only thing that has made volumes constant or rise as people get used to the station. As you’re coming through the store depending on where you are cued in the registers, it’s just not something that has worked. They’ve put digital signs up. They’ve put price signs. They’ve got the placard sign, it just isn’t effective to the customers as they come out, they’re pushing their cart, they can see the fuel station, they see the price sign, they make the connection. And that’s through a track record of 1,400 stores, that this is by far the most effective means to represent the price to a customer. Caramagno: What’s the option of sales from people coming out of the store, do they have a number of what percentage of sales come out of the store? Petitioner: You know I’ve asked that question, I’ve represented probably fifty of these for Kroger in a local market, they don’t harvest numbers that way in a traditional sense. It would seem to be I would say more traffic is generated from Kroger shoppers leaving the store than it is by traffic through the street, that’s my gut, I don’t have any scientific evidence but lots of people --- let me say I do it, my wife does it, her friends do it, we talk to customers when they sign petitions, people accumulate points in the store at 10 cents off a gallon for every $100, they’re very cognizant. The cashiers, when you’re done grocery shopping, they make a point now, thank goodness, of saying, please look at the bottom of your receipt, this is how many fuel points you’ve accumulated this month and they’ll expire on this date. So the last thing that our attendants say prior to departing stores, please buy Kroger gas, this is your discount. They leave the store, blammo, there’s a sign, they know that they can make an informed decision. It’s new trips, if that’s the other question, that majority are in traffic studies that we have for these fuel stations, it’s not a trip generator, it’s a secondary trip. So they go to the grocery store then they get gas, then they go home. Caramagno: And I think you said earlier and I probably wasn’t paying good enough attention, this is a lit sign, digitally lit sign? Petitioner: It’s illuminated but not in the electronic sense. There’s a glow to the number. If you looked at the existing sign that’s out there, it’s the exact same illumination. The number is static and appears white, that’s the only illumination, it’s not garish, it’s not --- the class of trade, whether it’s diesel or regular doesn’t make a difference, there’s only one class of trade. It’s a regular red band like in every fuel station and the white numeral that would describe the price. Caramagno: You change it how? Petitioner: It’s changed, that sign and the sign out of the street, have a key fob that they change numbers once a week, twice a week, however periodically they change the numbers but it’s not an electronic sign, it’s a static metal barrel that will actually roll. Caramagno: And I think I heard you say it’s something like a slot machine? City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 6 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: It is and it’s a very big slot machine. Caramagno: That’s all I’ve got, thank you. Henzi: Any other questions? Do you happen to know off the top of your head what the setback is between the canopy and the property line? Petitioner: You know I don’t have a scale drawing and I don’t have my readers with me. I’m going by parking spaces, it’s probably set back 70 or 80 feet from the road to the edge of the canopy. Henzi: All right. Petitioner: Because it’s actually full size on your drawings, on this ring drawing, I had them put those dimensions so you could see them, I just can’t read them. Henzi: Any other questions? Hearing none, is there anyone in the audience who wants to speak for or against this project? If so, come on up to the table. Knight: My name is Carroll Knight and I am a petroleum rep. I have done business in your state or in your City since 1972 and I’ve had as many as five, six stations at the same time in your City. I have requested price signs on a canopy and have been refused and I want to speak a little bit out of both sides of my mouth. I say all service stations should have the price sign on the canopy for visibility and it’s better for everybody. You’ve turned down me in the past and I think it should not be a variance of an individual, I think you should have the ruling that all stations can have that on the canopy or none can have it. And I am in favor of everybody having it on the canopy but I’m not happy that my competitor, and he’s a competitor of mine, I’m not too far from him, and I cannot get a sign on my canopy but it does help the business. Costco and Sam’s Club as this gentleman was speaking, they have their signs in the lobby as you exit the store where they can know the price of the product at that time and it seems to work for them very well of knowing the price. And I’m a very competitive person and I just want the same advantage that everybody else has. If you wish to grant that gentleman a canopy sign, I think all service stations in your City should be given the same opportunity. Any questions of me? McIntyre: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: I’m sorry, I may have missed your address. Knight: Where do I do my business, where’s my office, is that what you’re asking me, where I live, what would you like? McIntyre: Whatever address for the record. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 7 of 43 August 13, 2013 Knight: The record is written on the thing and my name, it’s 40600 Grand River, Novi, Michigan. McIntyre: And which, sir, could you tell us which service stations in Livonia? Knight: That I’ve had? McIntyre: Do you operate service stations now? Knight: Yes, I do, yes, I do. I’ve had a station at Eight Mile and Louise, Eight Mile and Merriman, I have one right now at Five Mile and Middlebelt, I have one at Plymouth and Levan, I’ve had a station on Plymouth Road near Inkster so I’ve done a lot of business within your city and service stations. McIntyre: And what advantage, it’s my understanding that this business is requesting the canopy sign to draw people from the parking lot, not from the street so I guess I’m not understanding --- Knight: But does it matter where you’re drawing them from and giving them the knowledge? As an individual I am trying to get people to come into my station and have the knowledge of what my price is. McIntyre: But you have a sign, right? Knight: And I would prefer to have one on the canopy than having a freestanding sign on the ground because it’s much better visibility. McIntyre: Okay. Knight: Any other questions? Henzi: Mr. Knight, do you operate any stations in other neighboring communities? Knight: I operate stations in five counties in this area, in Columbus, Ohio, in Dayton, Ohio, Jackson, Flint, Roscommon, Grayling, Houghton Lake. Henzi: Anything in a city that borders Livonia? Knight: Yes, Farmington Hills, I have a station in Farmington Hills at Eight Mile and Farmington Road. Henzi: What are the rules like in Farmington Hills or any other neighboring community to Livonia with respect to canopy signs? Knight: I misspoke. The one at Farmington and Eight Mile is Farmington, not Farmington Hills. I have gotten approval for canopy signs in the city of Farmington Hills, in the city of Warren I have been approved. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 8 of 43 August 13, 2013 Henzi: I’m asking what are the rules like? Are you saying that canopy signs are allowed in most other communities or something different? Knight: I can’t speak to that. You do get them approved by the cities and you’re able to put the price on a canopy. Henzi: Which station at Eight and Farmington do you own? Knight: The one on the northeast corner across from the Speedway. Henzi: Valero? Knight: Yes. Henzi: Do you have a canopy sign? Knight: I have no price sign on the canopy. I wished to put one up there and they did not approve it. Henzi: Okay. Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: One other question. I may be the only person in this room who does belong to Sam’s Club or Costco, but it’s my understanding that Sam’s Club and Costco, that you can only buy gasoline there if you are a member of those clubs, is that correct? Knight: That is true. McIntyre: Okay. So that’s a little bit different situation in advertising the price because you can only buy gas if you’re a member there and you don’t accumulate points? Knight: Right. McIntyre: I wanted to make sure I understood that, okay. Henzi: Thank you. Anybody else who wants to speak for or against the project? Sills: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: I would consider the geographic position of the station itself. Are any of your stations set back off the street like this one is? Knight: I’ve never seen this station so I don’t know what his looks like. Sills: Because this station isn’t curbside, it’s more or less in the center of the parking lot. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 9 of 43 August 13, 2013 Knight: And as I said, if anyone wants to accomplish those coming out of Kroger’s, do it like Costco does, put the sign right in their lobby. Every customer that leaves will see that sign. Henzi: Are there letters? Caramagno: Yes, there’s one. Approval, (letter read), Richard Gulligan, president, at 33900 Eight Mile Road, Suite 101. Henzi: Mr. Pisko, you have an opportunity for a closing statement. Petitioner: Very briefly. It’s 160 feet, my guess is probably as far as the distance. That’s it. Henzi: You know I seem to have another question or two. I’d like to know whether you know what your competitor like your Meijer at Eight and Haggerty or any other location, how they’ve been treated in neighboring communities? I’m talking about retailers that operate a service station, try and compare apples to apples. Petitioner: I can tell you personally, municipalities that I’ve represented where we’ve got price signs on the canopy, would that be helpful, is that what you’re looking for? Lyon Township, Warren, Saginaw, Bridgeport, Troy, Michigan, we just got one approved, it’s under construction in Novi, that one does not. John R and Nine Mile, boy, if I had my project list in front of me. We apply for these in most every circumstance but this is again to the uniqueness of this site. Sometimes the monument sign is just enough. The site is positioned as such that the gas station is pushed to the corner and is in the traditional shape you would have for a gas station. This doesn’t have dedicated approaches. It’s using existing approaches, it’s set so far back that it really is more customer centered than other gas stations. And that’s our issue. When you look at the signs, if I didn’t tell you there’s a monument sign to your left in that first photograph, it would be very difficult for you to see it. And our photographer went out there and took the picture. I said Michael, sit there for twenty minutes, see if there’s any sight line, you know, but customers --- or the employees are told to park as far away from the store as they can so these actual parking spaces go away. That sign is always blocked and to Mr. Knight’s credit, it is infinitely important to advertise that price. Henzi: Thank you. Petitioner: You bet. Henzi: I’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the Board’s comments --- Caramagno: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: I have one more question, please. Has there ever been any consideration of putting the sign on one of these islands right here as you’re walking out of the store? City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 10 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: You know we run into the same sightline issue with --- that sign is elevated, when you look at the parking field, that parking field is now ruined with the addition of traffic and there’s no clear sightline to the island. Caramagno: Okay, thank you. Henzi: I’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the Board’s comments with Mr. Sills. Sills: I think I could approve this petition based on where the location of the station itself is. And I personally went to this Kroger store and I come out and I think the petition is well thought out and I think I can support it. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: This is a unique location and I think – well, I know this is the first Kroger fuel station center that we’ve added in Livonia. I would view it differently if it were an additional canopy sign facing the Eight Mile so that would be the northern elevation that was attempting to draw traffic in or were it closer to the northern end of the canopy. But given that this to me is unique because they want to make sure their shoppers exiting the store see this. Again, I think there’s a difference between Costco and Sam’s Club and Kroger because Sam’s Club and Costco you have to be a member to shop at their gas stations, so I think there’s greater awareness when you go into Costco and I’m not a member but definitely there’s greater awareness of the fact that you go there and you try and think okay, I’m going to get gas. This is a new station. I think the landscaping around this fuel station, I think it looks very nice and that’s another reason in my mind this is a significant net benefit to our community. It brings Kroger fuel which is price competitive even moreso if you’re a participant in their point program. It’s really nicely landscaped. The Kroger fuel stations that I frequent seem to be kept up in terms of maintenance keeping with their corporate standards. And I think this is unique enough and at the time we put our sign regulations together, we didn’t I think think about the possibility of these set off the road fuel stations that were an adjunct to an existing retailer so I can go along with it. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: I’ve got some concerns myself. We didn’t have a lot of letters against and I don’t see much residential impact. The issue I have is the precedence this starts and I understand that there is certain differences between the Kroger and the Costco and Sam’s Club, yet, you know, like you said, the other gas stations have the right to advertise as well I feel. And we do one and you are going to open up this Board to every sign in Livonia, every gas station in Livonia, not that we don’t need the work but it’s going to be hard to differentiate between them all for the traffic coming in and out of the door of Kroger shopping. And these signs will also to me be some of the highest elevated and lit signs that we have in this city aside from industrial areas where we have large signs on big buildings and nonresidential areas. So at this point and when I say high, I mean elevated in the air, so at this time I’m not in support. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 11 of 43 August 13, 2013 Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: I will be in support, you know, the unique location of the property in the middle of Eight Mile, you’re only targeting people walking out of your store with your gas station there. I think due to the unique location right outside your store, the only people that will see it aren’t people that are driving by, it’s only those that walk out of your store, for those reasons I’ll be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McCue. McCue: I tend to go on the side of where Mr. Caramagno is coming from. My concern is the precedent starting because I know, I hear what you’re saying as far as it being a unique situation and the way your building is laid out, but I think there are a variety of other, i.e. Meijer or other places that could probably make the same type of case. And I am concerned that if we start one, I think we’re going to be seeing a lot of these variances. So I think because of that alone I will probably not be in support. Henzi: I won’t support it either. I’m not against signs on a canopy, but I think this is exactly like the Costco, Sam’s Club situation because the Petitioner said that they want the sign to attract their own customers and it would make more sense to me if for example they said that they wanted this facing Eight Mile to attract outside customers. For that reason, I don’t see why it’s necessary, it seems superfluous. Caramagno: Three to three. Henzi: I would suggest tabling it. Caramagno: Will Craig be here on the 27th? Henzi: Yes. Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Upon Motion by Duggan, supported by Sills, it was: RESOLVED: APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-31 (Tabled on August 13, 2013): N.W. Northridge, LLC, One National Plaza, Columbus, OH 43215, on behalf of Kroger of Michigan, 40393 Grand River, Novi, MI 48375 seeking to install an electronic fuel price sign upon a fuel pump canopy which is not allowed. This type of sign must be placed on a conforming ground sign. The property is located on the south side of Eight Mile (33797), between Gill and Farmington, Lot No. 013-99-0032-004, C-2 Zoning District. Rejected by the Inspection Department under Zoning Ordinance 543, Section 18.50H(o) “Sign Regulations in C-1, C-2, C-3 and C-4 Districts,” be tabled so the Petitioner can be heard before a full Board. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 12 of 43 August 13, 2013 ROLL CALL VOTE: AYES: Duggan, Sills, McCue, McIntyre, Caramagno, Henzi NAYS: None ABSENT: Pastor Henzi: This is tabled, you’ve got three votes, you need four. This is a typical procedure to table so you don’t have to pay for rescheduling. The next available meeting is September 10th and if you want that date, call Bonnie by this Friday. Petitioner: Thank you, very much. Henzi: Thank you. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 13 of 43 August 13, 2013 APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-32: Landscape Consultants, P.O. Box 9, Dearborn Heights, MI 48127, on behalf of Whispering Winds Condos, 9403 Lamont, Livonia, MI 48150, seeking to remove the existing entranceway sign and construct a new sign requiring Zoning Board of Appeals approval. Henzi: Mr. Kearfott, anything to add to this case? Kearfott: Not at this time. Henzi: Any questions for the Inspection Department? Hearing none, will the Petitioner please come to the table. Good evening. Petitioner: Good evening everyone. Michael P. Elliott, I’m the owner of Landscape Consultants. Our address is P.O. Box 9, Dearborn Heights, Michigan. I’m representing Whispering Winds Condominiums. I also have the management company here and the president of the association so they could help with any questions or anything that you might have. Henzi: There is a rendering in our packet, we understand the top is a rendering of what it is going to look like? Petitioner: I believe and they could tell me better, I believe the sign is about 25 years old and there’s an existing wood sign there that’s in need of repair. And we’re proposing or asking to still stay within limits of just going with an engraved limestone sign that I believe it’s actually a couple square feet smaller but it’s more of a modern sign on a brick base. And we’re asking to move it up 15 feet which still I believe gives us 10 or 15 feet from what the setback allows us. So it’s just we’ve had a lot of – and not to be rude – Whispering Winds is probably considered a --- can I say this ---- an adult senior citizen community? Henzi: You said it. Petitioner: And Newburgh is a very busy street and the sign was set back so far that when their friends and stuff come over, they miss it sometimes so we’re just trying to move it up 10 or 15 feet and modernize it. It’s not changing anything else basically but a new sign and just moving it up. Henzi: So the modernized version is on the top here so it’s going to look just like that with new landscaping, new limestone sign. Petitioner: Well, yes, that was just a computer rendering. The landscaping isn’t what it’s going to be but the picture is for the sign. It’s a limestone engraved sign. Henzi: Well, are you going to remove the tree in the front? Petitioner: Help me. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 14 of 43 August 13, 2013 Opiela: My name is Mike Opiela, with Majestic Condo Management, have the business address 9403 Lamont. The sign is going to be moved 15 feet forward. Originally there were three trees there, the one in the middle died, we took it out and that actually gave a place for us to move the sign forward. Henzi: Okay. Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: I’m still confused. Will this tree stay? Petitioner: The very first tree stays. McIntyre: Thank you. Opiela: There’s a tree on each side of the island. McIntyre: Got it. Opiela: There was three trees. McIntyre: Okay. Opiela: And with the middle one being infected, we just didn’t want to lose all of them so we took that one out. McIntyre: Okay. Henzi: Any other questions? Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: So you guys are moving this up because it’s difficult to see in its current location and you’re going to modernize it? Petitioner: Yes. Duggan: What about if you move it up closer to the tree does the tree effect the visibility of the sign? Petitioner: No. We’re still a good 15, 20 feet away from there. It’s a 60-foot wide island, a long island I believe, yeah, 66 feet the island is. If you kind of look closely at that front tree, there’s landscape brick around it. It would be that landscape brick even though we’re changing the brick, it will have the same footprint. The landscape brick and that that’s between the sign and the tree, that’s where the sign is going. Duggan: Okay. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 15 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: The sign is actually going to be a little bit lower and the sign itself is going to be shorter. And then coming from either direction driving down Newburgh Road, you actually get to see it when it’s that far forward. Duggan: Great, thank you. Henzi: Any other questions. Caramagno: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: Lighting, are you still planning on putting some light on it? Petitioner: There’s lights on the current sign but we’ll just move them forward to light the sign. Carmagno: Thank you. Henzi: Anything else? Hearing none, is there anyone in the audience who wants to speak for or against this project? If so, come on up. Seeing no one come forward, is there letters? Caramagno: No. Henzi: Gentlemen, anything you’d like to say in closing? Petitioner: My personal thing is we went through the place, and they painted, they’re really updating their complex and I think and I don’t mean, I think most of you have probably driven through this, and with this request it’s a pretty nice looking place and they’re trying to keep it up which is good for the city and their property values also obviously. Henzi: Thank you. We’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the Board’s comments with Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: You take a sign that needs updating, there’s a deterioration of wood, and you see a brand new sign that is easier to see, a more attractive modern looking sign, I will be in support. Petitioner: And I don’t know if we mentioned, the original wood sign had a brick base that was actually because of the moisture in there, it was a planter and it was toppling and crumbling so for safety’s sake we removed the brick but the sign is still there. McIntyre: Full support. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 16 of 43 August 13, 2013 Caramagno: Nice improvement. I almost drove by the place myself trying to find it. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: I did drive by it and I didn’t find it the first time so yes, I will be in support. I think you need it. Henzi: Mrs. McCue. McCue: I would agree. It’s a nice improvement so I will support. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: I also drove by it the first time and I came back and looked at it. I like the idea of the new sign and there certainly won’t be any maintenance on the new sign and the old sign the wood is deteriorating so I will approve of this. Henzi: I, too, will approve for all the reasons already stated so the floor is open for a motion. Upon motion by McCue, supported by Caramagno, it was: RESOLVED: APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-32: Landscape Consultants, P.O. Box 9, Dearborn Heights, MI 48127, on behalf of Whispering Winds Condos, 9403 Lamont, Livonia, MI 48150, seeking to remove the existing entranceway sign and construct a new sign requiring Zoning Board of Appeals approval. The property is located on the median between 9411 Newburgh and 9322 Inspection Department under Zoning Ordinance 543, Section 18.50E(h) “Sign Regulations for Residential Districts,” be granted for the following reasons and findings of fact: 1. The uniqueness requirement is met because it is a residential condo area where easily identifiable signage is needed for that location. 2. Denial of the variance would have severe consequences for the Petitioner because it would reduce visibility for visitors and residents. 3.The variance is fair in light of its effect on neighboring properties and in the spirit of the Zoning Ordinance because of its location and other established condo complexes having like signage. 4.The Board received no letters of approval and no objection letters from neighboring property owners. 5.The property is classified as “Medium Density Residential” in the Master Plan and the proposed variance is not inconsistent with that classification. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 17 of 43 August 13, 2013 FURTHER, This variance is granted with the following conditions: 1. That it be erected as presented to the Board. 2. That the existing tree, located on the median immediately east of the location proposed for the new sign, be maintained. 3. That the variance is good for six months. ROLL CALL VOTE: AYES: McCue, Caramagno, McIntyre, Duggan, Sills, Henzi NAYS: None ABSENT: Pastor Henzi: The variance is granted with those conditions, you’ve got to erect the sign you’ve proposed in the spot where you proposed, maintaining the tree as you proposed here tonight and completed within six months. Petitioner: We’ll be done in a couple weeks. Henzi: Good. Petitioner: Thank you. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 18 of 43 August 13, 2013 APPEAL CASE NO: 2013-08-33: ABA Investments, LLC, 32649 Greenland Court, on behalf of Lessee Masons II, Inc., 29401 Five Mile, Livonia, MI 48154 seeking to reaffirm a previous variance, Case No. 2007-06-38, which has since expired, to construct a commercial retail building associated with fuel sales resulting in deficient front yard setback and deficient number of parking spaces. Henzi: Mr. Kearfott, anything to add to this case? Kearfott: Not at this time. Henzi: Any questions for Mr. Kearfott? Hearing none, would the Petitioner please come to the table. Good evening. Petitioner: Good evening. My name is Hakim Shakir, address 32232 Schoolcraft Road, Livonia, Michigan and I’m the project engineer for this project and I also have owner with me in case you have questions for him. And this again, like I said, this project was approved in 2007 and we got variances for setbacks and plus the parking because we were deficient on that and it was approved. At that time the owner did not have enough funds available to carry on but now he wants to start construction and I gave him the plans that I have which you have a copy of them. The building right now is not meeting all the Codes existing and also the traffic flow and everything was not that great so I can pass the existing. Henzi: Are you proposing the same one that was proposed in 2007 or is it different? Petitioner: No, it’s a little different. You wonder about the color, the material, everything is different. I brought some material to show it’s going to be. You also have the plans and everything for the building and this is the material we’re going to be using, it was approved by the Planning Commission. Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: It’s true you have a deficient number of parking spaces? Petitioner: Yes. Duggan: Is that going to be a problem for your customers? Petitioner: No, it required nineteen and they close to eleven. Duggan: How many do you typically fill at one given time? Petitioner: (Giryoun) Most likely they’ll park at the pump and go in. Petitioner: (Shakir) It’s not always full. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 19 of 43 August 13, 2013 Duggan: Well, is it ever full? Petitioner: (Shakir) Is it ever full? Petitioner: (Giryoun) We’ve never had a problem. Duggan: But you don’t think you’ll have a problem with three less parking spots? Petitioner: (Giryoun) Correct. Henzi: What’s your name for the record? Petitioner: (Giryoun) Moshin Ghiroun. Petitioner: (Shakir) He’s the property owner and also the owner of the gas station. Henzi: Any other questions? Caramagno: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: How many parking spots do you have now? Petitioner: (Shakir) Eleven. Caramagno: You have eleven, you’re going to maintain eleven? Petitioner: (Shakir) Yes. Caramagno: What are you going to do with the extra --- you’ve got 2200 feet of store now, you’re going to 35 --- almost 3550 feet, so what is that extra storage space going to get you? Petitioner: (Giryoun) I say the building we have right now was the same back in the early ‘80s where we only had Pepsi, now Pepsi has 30, 40, 50 flavors, Coca-Cola the same thing. We need room, you know, to store all the product. Caramagno: So as you become bigger, do you need more parking? What’s good today may not be good tomorrow. Petitioner: (Shakir) I don’t believe so. Petitioner: (Giryoun) People usually park at the pump and come in and then the rest of the parking we have. Caramagno: Is there a typical number of parking spaces? City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 20 of 43 August 13, 2013 Kearfott: I don’t have that number if there is a typical number of parking spaces for a gas station. Fisher: I guess one way to respond to that is it doesn’t look like there’s a parking variance sought. Caramagno: What does the request say? Petitioner: (Giryoun) We’re just reaffirming from 2007. Caramagno: Is the building the same size? Petitioner: (Shakir) Yes, building is the same size. Caramagno: Same size? Petitioner: (Shakir) Yes, sir. The 3500 was before in 2007 exactly the same except the elevation has changed. Caramagno: Thank you. Petitioner: (Shakir) Yes, sir. McIntyre: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: Are you going to have the whole area like Speedway and Seven Eleven with the prepared food and coffee and slurpees and all those things? Petitioner: (Giryoun) We don’t have room for all that right now, we have coffee and pop. McIntyre: And I asked relative to the number of parking spaces, that’s kind of the genesis of my question. Because if the food is incidental to the gas it’s one thing but if you’re going to have any food to attract people in who aren’t buying gas, then the parking is important. Petitioner: (Giryoun) We have no plans for anything now. McIntyre: Okay. Henzi: Any other questions? Hearing none, is there anybody in the audience who wants to speak for or against the project? If so, come on up. Knight: Again, my name is Carroll Knight, Knight Enterprises. And I happen to have a station kitty-corner to these guys. And these gentlemen have been business partners of mine or I’ve wholesaled gasoline to them at other places and they are good operators. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 21 of 43 August 13, 2013 And I say to you, the members of this commission, if it does not harm the public and it helps the businessman, you should approve it. And it’s going to hurt me but I still say you should approve it because it’s helping the public and it’s helping them so I’m for the program. McIntyre: I have a question of Mr. Knight. Henzi: Mr. Knight, hang on. McIntyre: I’m just curious then about your opposition to the Kroger because, you know, no public was harmed. Knight: My opposition is that you should approve it, I said I’m for signs on canopies but you should not make it a variance thing, it should be in your ordinance that all service stations can have their price signs on the canopy. McIntyre: But you also understand they’re seeking a variance here. Knight: I understand. As I say in anything you do in your meetings with the public, if it does not harm the public and it helps the businessman you should approve them. But when it comes to the canopy thing, I’m saying, sure, I think he should have that. But I say that all service stations in the city of Livonia should be able to put a price sign on their canopy to advertise their product. McIntyre: Okay. Knight: Okay. Henzi: Does anybody else want to speak for or against the project? Seeing no one come forward --- Caramagno: Mr. Chair, I’ve got another questions. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: Where is this, with this limited parking, limited parking spaces, limited setback, where is your fuel dropping, how will that impact your traffic flow on your property? Ali: My name is Alex Ali and I’m half owner of that property. The fuel, the tanks are going to stay where they are right now. Now, is it going to be coming from Five Mile or is it going to be coming from Middlebelt? So, it’s going to be convenience, in and out, it will be even better for the drop on the gasoline. On the parking issue, to my opinion, it’s going to be very convenient for the people who is going to be coming in the store because the parking is going to be right in the front of the building, it’s going to be in and out. Right now there’s no parking in front of the building. You’re going to either be parking behind the building or at the pump. For the traffic, it will be better when you park right in front of the building in and out so. And I don’t think we have a problem with City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 22 of 43 August 13, 2013 the parking because we’re never going to have, you know the station is going to have eight dispensers, eight cars, plus the one in front of the building, we never had that all filled you know with cars. Caramagno: This leads me to another question for my information. Have you ever asked your fuel delivery company what they think about the small parking lot? Ali: Delivery? Caramagno: Yes, who delivers your fuel, who do you get your fuel from? Ali: Great Lakes. Caramagno: Great Lakes? Ali: Yeah. Caramagno: Did they ever inquire about the parking lot, the size, the ability to get that tanker in and out of it? Ali: No. Caramagno: It’s never an issue for them? Ali: No. Plus it will be better for them right now because the way that the building is right now is going to go so it will be more opening for them to drive and just go right into Middlebelt. Caramagno: Okay, good. Thank you. Ali: Yes, sir. Henzi: Anybody else want to speak for or against the project? Are there letters? Caramagno: No. Henzi: Gentlemen, you have an opportunity for a closing statement, is there anything you’d like to say? Petitioner: (Sakir) No. Henzi: All right. I’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the Board’s comments with Mr. Caramagno. Caramago: Well, you know, as I look back at the minutes of this case, I was here last time and it looked reasonable and doable and is an improvement, it’s an old station, and it will spruce up that corner which is good, that corner is very old. I think it will be good for that part of Livonia, and the investment is going to be incredible, I wish you luck. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 23 of 43 August 13, 2013 Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: I, too, will be in support. It’s a definite upgrade from the current station. I think it will be a big improvement on that corner and I will be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McCue. McCue: I agree with what they said, it’s a huge investment, we appreciate the investment in that property, it will drastically improve that so I will be in support as well. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: It’s a very busy corner, the station that’s there, the building that is there has been there forever. I think anything would be an improvement and I definitely will be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: When I think of the term blight in Livonia, what I usually think of is service stations and we have some really nice looking service stations. Also, I think that the worst kind of categorically, the worst looking businesses in Livonia are service stations. And I’m tired of service stations, the curbs are cracked, they’re overgrown with weeds, there are nasty planters out front that are full of dead plants or weeds, so I think this is going to be a tremendous improvement and I also hope that the same amount of dedication that’s put in to building a nice spot will be reflected, continuing maintenance and upkeep of landscaping, I think I really appreciate your comments about Livonia. To me one of the things you’re doing here at a service station in Livonia, you show respect to your community by maintaining the property so I will look forward to a great improvement and a really nicely continuously maintained place so thank you and thanks for your investment. Henzi: I feel the same way. I heard this in 2007, I say go, go go. You know in my opinion people park at the pump, I don’t think parking is a problem at all it’s just a reality so the floor is open for a motion. Upon motion by McIntyre, supported by Caramagno, it was: RESOLVED: APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-33: ABA Investments, LLC, 32649 Greenland Court, on behalf of Lessee Masons II, Inc., 29401 Five Mile, Livonia, MI 48154 seeking to reaffirm a previous variance, Case No. 2007-06-38, which has since expired, to construct a commercial retail building associated with fuel sales resulting in deficient front yard setback and deficient number of parking spaces. The property is located on the south side of Five Mile (29401), between Beatrice and Middlebelt, Lot No. 089-99-0001-001, C-2 Zoning District. Rejected by the Inspection Department under Zoning Ordinance No. 543, Section 11.03(a),(2) and Section 11.03 (a), (12), (d), “Waiver Uses,” be granted for the following reasons and findings of fact: City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 24 of 43 August 13, 2013 1. The uniqueness requirement is met because of its location and the size of the lot. 2. Denial of the variance would have severe consequences for the Petitioner because it would not allow the business to be competitive with other businesses in the area. 3. The variance is fair in light of its effect on neighboring properties and in the spirit of the Zoning Ordinance because the setback and parking space deficiency won’t adversely impact residents. 4. The Board received no letters of approval and no objection letters from neighboring property owners. 5. The property is classified as “General Commercial” in the Master Plan and the proposed variance is not inconsistent with that classification. FURTHER, This variance is granted with the following conditions: 1. That it be built as presented to the Board. ROLL CALL VOTE: AYES: McIntyre, Caragno, McCue, Duggan, Sills, Henzi NAYS: None. ABSENT: Pastor. Henzi: The variance is granted with that one condition, that you’ve got to construct it as presented. Petitioners: Thank you. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 25 of 43 August 13, 2013 APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-34: Bryan Szostak, 35100 Orangelawn, Livonia, MI 48150 seeking to erect a six foot tall privacy fence within the side yard which is not allowed. Privacy fences cannot extend beyond the rear line of the dwelling. Henzi: Mr. Kearfott, anything to add on this case? Kearfott: Not at this time. Henzi: Any questions for the Inspection Department? Hearing none, will the Petitioner please come forward? Good evening. Petitioner: Hi. Bryan Szostak at 35100 Orangelawn. Henzi: Mrs. Szostak, tell us why you want to construct a privacy fence or a section of a privacy fence. Petitioner: I’d like to put a privacy fence on that portion of my house primarily because of the way the street is shaped I’m kind of on a rear corner and the position of my home allows my dogs to stand on either side of --- well, mostly that side of the house and look in both directions down the street, barking at neighbors. And with the neighbor to my east, the way their house is positioned, they have two small children which my dogs tend to go and bark at. I am a police officer and one of my dogs is a working dog. I wrote the letter, “Working dogs are friendly, however, they do have limits.” So this would eliminate any temptation. Standard 4-foot fences, we train our dogs to jump over them so something like that just wouldn’t work for that dog. I considered moving the fence back to the back corner of the house, but that would allow that side of my property to be open and I have two egress windows on that side of the home and having little kids playing in the side yard, I can’t see that side of the house, I wouldn’t be able to know if someone was messing around on the egress windows. Henzi: Do I understand correctly that it’s about 34-feet of fence that you’re proposing on the east side? Petitioner: The front, the very front of the house, I think it’s like a 10-foot section and then that runs along the side of the house from the front of the house to the back. Henzi: Okay. And then what you’re saying is you don’t need it all the way to the rear property line because you’re really only trying to shield the opening? Petitioner: Right. At this stage I’m just doing that small portion because it’s outside city variance. I have to do it in stages because of the fencing that I agreed with the neighbors is a white vinyl fence, it’s very expensive, that section is going to cost me $5,000 just for that one piece if it’s approved. My ultimate plan is to do the other side of my house with a gate and then along all the way around the yard but I’m going to have to do it in sections. Henzi: And then we’ve got a drawing or a photo? City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 26 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: Right. Henzi: You’ve got one circled, that’s the one you want, just in white? Petitioner: Right. Henzi: Is that what your neighbor asked you for? Petitioner: Yes. Henzi: Okay. Any questions for the Petitioner? Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: My understanding is you said you had a problem with the dogs barking, did any of the neighbors complain to you about it or is it something that you’re conscious of and don’t want them to come to you in the future? Petitioner: It’s just one I’m conscious of, I don’t allow my animals to bark at people, but they’re on that side of the house. I’m more worried of them scaring the little girls that live next door more than anything. Like I said, my dogs are very friendly. Again, working dogs have their limits so I’m kind of conscious of that. Duggan: Thank you. Henzi: Anything else? Sills: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: As I’m looking at this sketch here, it shows that you want to put 34-feet of fence, 6-foot fence? Petitioner: Yes, sir. Sills; Now, you said that your dogs can easily jump over a 4-foot chain link, right? Petitioner: Yes, sir. Sills: Well, if you only get 34-feet of vinyl fence and the rest of it is chainlink, what would prevent your dogs from jumping over that? Petitioner: Well, ultimately I want to do the whole yard in the same 6-foot fence but I can only afford to do a small portion at a time. And that is the section where the largest draw for the dogs is at, where I can’t see them around that corner of the house. So that City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 27 of 43 August 13, 2013 is my priority in the first section because I can’t see them when they go around that corner of the house and they can see all the way down Hamilton and all the way down Orangelawn the other way. Sills: Well, my idea is they could still jump over the fence past the 34-feet, right? Petitioner: They could, that’s correct. Sills: So you’re really not solving the problem, you’re only partially solving it. Petitioner: I’m partially solving the problem for people in the front because people walk and that’s the driveway side for our neighbor where that piece is at. Petitioner: (Michelle) And then the children are out in the backyard alone. Petitioner: (Bryan) That’s my wife. Sills: You’ve got a huge yard there and it’s going to cost you a fortune to fence it. Petitioner: (Bryan) It is, it is. That’s why I have to do it in pieces. Sills: So I can understand why you have to do it in sections. Okay, thank you, very much. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: Let me know if I’m correct, the issue is not being able to see the dogs and what they’re doing because my understanding from my visit the other day, one is a working dog and one is a retired working dog, that both of those dogs are under voice command, in other words when you can see them and you tell them to do something, they will do it. Petitioner: (Bryan) Correct. McIntyre: So it’s not so much concern when they are in your sightline because they will be unlike any dog I’ve ever had, immediately respond to a voice command from you, is that correct? Petitioner: (Bryan) Correct. One of the issues, too, is my dog is trained to listen to me only. McIntyre: Yes, that’s what I mean. Petitioner: (Bryan) When my wife is home and she has to let them out, they can’t go on that side and look down the street at the neighbor kids and people walking their dogs because my work dog won’t listen to her. McIntyre: Thank you. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 28 of 43 August 13, 2013 Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: Does one of your neighbors in the back, one of the far back corners, have a privacy fence against yours? Petitioner: (Bryan) They just had it put up, yes. Duggan: Was that because of your dogs or is there another reason? Petitioner: (Bryan) I don’t know if it’s my dogs or me or them but yes. Duggan: My question is how does the fence that you’re putting in, how does it compare to theirs? Petitioner: (Bryan) It’s very similar to theirs, very similar. Duggan: Thank you. Henzi: Anything else? Is there anybody in the audience who wants to speak for or against the project? If so, come on up. Seeing no one, can you read the letters? Caramagno: Yes. We have an objection from Jimmy Kendrick, at 10049 Hambelton, (letter read). Barry Lamerand at 35135 Parkdale writes and approval, (letter read). Approval from Bruce 34969 Parkdale (letter read). Thomas Haber at 34957 Parkdale, approval (letter read). Objection from Mark Olson at 10008 Hambelton, (letter read). An approval from Kelly Caltabiano at 10050 Hambelton. Barbara Hudson sends an approval at 34981 Parkdale, an objection from Cheryl and Ronald Patterson at 10020 Hambelton, (letter read). And an approval by Wendy Richards at 10289 Wayne Road. Henzi: Mr. Szostak, anything you’d like to say in closing? Petitioner: (Bryan) No. Henzi: Thanks. I’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the Board’s comments with Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: I’ll be in support. This is a special need for some special dogs. It’s not going all the way around the property and that’s primarily for financial reasons but it is an odd shaped yard, there’s not many houses on that street that are going to be able to look two ways down the street from the corner of the house and those dogs certainly have seen traffic and pedestrians come from north of Hambelton and of course eastbound on Orangelawn. I don’t find that unreasonable. We all know the financial constraints of putting up a quality fence which I think is a good thing. He’s got a couple complaints from neighbors and I was just counting those, one, two, three, hopefully he heard that, too, and will take care of some other issues, at least as they perceive them. So I will be in support. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 29 of 43 August 13, 2013 Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: I, too, will be in support. You’ve got a uniquely shaped property, you’re right there on the corner and on top of that you’ve got a neighbor behind you that already has a privacy fence, too. So I think due to the unique layout of your property, you can see both ways off your backyard that you need a privacy fence and I will be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McCue. McCue: I will also be in support, again, with what was said, your yard, the uniqueness of your dogs and other people in the neighborhood that have privacy fences so I will be in support. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: I’ll be in support even though I was quite confused when I walked back and saw a Canton police car there, but I will be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: I’ll be in support. I noticed the privacy fence that came up to the corner of the house I believe at Orangelawn and Yale and the same kind of corner, and I’m talking about the eastern edge, same kind of thing, they’re on a corner lot and I think I would suggest maybe that you take care never to park on the grass and keep your neighbors happy and keep your property up and your dogs clean. While they clearly don’t pose a threat to anybody, it’s just an issue of consideration in keeping them under control, no objection, and a very unusual lot. Henzi: I agree with Mrs. McIntyre. I think that there is good cause for doing this. I think that quite frankly this is a unique application in that it’s sparked by Mr. Szostak’s thoughtfulness and consideration for his neighborhood as opposed to what a lot of fence petitioners ask to close in for some different reasons and I appreciate that and I think that you should be able to have this section of the fence so I’ll approve it. The floor is open for a motion. Upon motion by Duggan, supported by Caramagno, it was: RESOLVED: APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-34: Bryan Szostak, 35100 Orangelawn, Livonia, MI 48150 seeking to erect a six foot tall privacy fence within the side yard which is not allowed. Privacy fences cannot extend beyond the rear line of the dwelling. The property is located on the north side of Orangelawn (35100), between Yale and Hambelton, Lot No. 130-03-0114-000, R-1 Zoning District. Rejected by the Inspection Department under Fence Ordinance, Section 15.44.090,B a “Residential District Regulations,” be granted for the following reasons and findings of fact: City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 30 of 43 August 13, 2013 1.The uniqueness requirement is met because of the location of the property on a corner and Petitioner’s dogs being able to visualize pedestrians and cars coming from both directions. 2.Denial of the variance would have severe consequences for the Petitioner because his variance request was made in consideration of his neighbors. 3.The variance is fair in light of its effect on neighboring properties and in the spirit of the Zoning Ordinance because he has the support of the majority of the neighboring properties. 4.The Board received six (6) letters of approval and three (3) objection letters from neighboring property owners. 5.The property is classified as “Low Density Residential” in the Master Plan and the proposed variance is not inconsistent with that classification. FURTHER, This variance is granted with the following conditions: 1. That the fence be erected as presented. 2. That the chain link fence be removed. 3. That the variance is good for six months. ROLL CALL VOTE: AYES: Duggan, Caramagno, McCue, McIntyre, Sills, Henzi NAYS: None. ABSENT: Pastor. Henzi: The variance is granted with three conditions, you’ve got to erect the fence as you presented, meaning the type of fence in the spot where you proposed it. You’ve got to remove the chain link, you can’t have a double fence and it’s good for six months, and that doesn’t mean that it expires it means that you’ve got to complete it within that time frame. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 31 of 43 August 13, 2013 APPEAL CASE 2013-08-35: Sheldon Center, LLC, 24255 13 Mile Road, Suite 220, Bingham Farms, MI 48025, on behalf of Lessee, My Hobby Place and Toys, 33201 Plymouth Road, Livonia, MI 48150 seeking to construct a wall sign upon a tenant space resulting in excess sign area. Henzi: Mr. Kearfott, anything to add to this case? Kearfott: Not at this time. Henzi: Any questions for the Inspection Department? Hearing none will the Petitioner or Representative please come forward? Good evening. Petitioner: How do you do. My name is Carl Grenadier, I’m one of the members of the Sheldon Center, LLC, who owns this shopping center there at Plymouth and Farmington Road. I’m here on behalf of my tenant that will open up the new My Hobby Place and Toys and we’re looking for a variance with the signage because of the frontage. The space is 11,000 feet, it’s shaped in an L-form which is about 60-foot in the front but it’s over 100 foot in the back and it sets back from Plymouth Road about 350 feet. So, consequently we went to the requirements of the ordinance and to be visible from the road, people would have a hardship reading the sign from Plymouth Road. Henzi: Mr. Grenadier, I have a question for you. In your application you wrote that the building depth, increase in frontage, decreases the amount of sign, are you saying because this is a deep building? Petitioner: Yes, it is extraordinarily deep. Henzi: It’s 11,000 square feet, if it was configured a different way, they’d have much longer frontage? Petitioner: Exactly. Henzi: Okay. Petitioner: Yeah, typically, you know properties that are build today are only about 75 feet deep whereas this is 150 foot deep. Henzi: Okay. Petitioner: And as I say it is L-shaped and it is only 60 foot in the frontage but it’s over 100 feet in the rear. Henzi: Any other questions? Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 32 of 43 August 13, 2013 Duggan: I just want to clarify, you own the whole strip, the whole strip mall right there? Petitioner: Yes. Duggan: What is the size of the Larry’s Foodland, I know that you said the larger frontage means a larger sign, do you know off the top of your head the size of Larry’s Foodland or the Rite-Aid right next to you? Petitioner: I’d be guessing. Duggan: What would you say? Petitioner: Larry’s Foodland is approximately 14,000 feet. The Rite-Aid is probably about 12,000. Duggan: How does this one compare to those ones? Petitioner: Well, it’s almost equal in size. This is about 11,000 feet. Duggan: What about, what was right next to this, was there a lottery place? Petitioner: Yes, that’s right, State of Michigan. Duggan: What size is that? Petitioner: Well, I think that’s only about 8,000. Duggan: Okay, thank you. Henzi: Any other questions? No. Is there anybody in the audience who wants to speak for or against the project? If so, come on up. Laing: My name is Lisa Laing, I’m the owner of the business. My address is 34123 Trillium Court in Livonia. My two biggest concerns about the sign issue was most of the other signs in the complex are larger and I’m concerned that if our sign is the 60 square feet it will be drowned out a little bit from the size of the other signs. So I’m just trying to keep it a little bit more in proportion with the other businesses, the size of the signs of the other businesses in the complex. And I was concerned about the visibility from the road, you know, because it is set so far back from Plymouth Road that if people are driving by, I do want them to notice our sign and that will be good for business. And that also brings us back to the issue of the other signs being larger also, so those are my two biggest concerns. Petitioner: It will make it more uniform with the other tenants. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 33 of 43 August 13, 2013 Henzi: There was something in the application about the fact that your store is sort of a specialty store, you have people that come from all over, not just one corner of Livonia but all over Metro Detroit; why is that? Laing: I’m trying to do something unique that you don’t see in toy stores anymore. I don’t want to be Toys R Us, I don’t want to be your typical big box store, I do a lot of unique things for kids like special play areas for doing like a custom design by having a tree in the store for interactive, so kids will go into it and do activities, so I’m trying to make it a destination so I’m hoping word of mouth spreads and people that come just out of curiosity’s sake. And also, we do have a lot of toys and hobby items that you just can’t find anymore. So I’m hoping this combination of everything that will just make it special. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: Is My Hobby Place a franchise or is this an independent? Laing: I started in my garage twelve years ago. It’s mostly internet actually up to this point. Up until recentlywe were mostly 99 percent and we’re partnered with Amazon, and I have a small little retail store on Levan just across from the Ford plant, but the intention of that store wasn’t --- it was more internet and the store was kind of an afterthought because we just wanted to kind of see how it would go and now it’s been two years since we’ve had that place, I wanted to have something special. McIntyre: I knew I had seen your location, okay, thank you. Henzi: Any other questions? Are there letters? Caramagno: There’s an objection from Joe Lanzon, 11589 Farmington Road, (letter read). Henzi: Is there anything you would like to say in closing? Petitioner: Not specifically, just that it is a hardship because it is so far set back from Plymouth Road, 350 feet, and most of these other signs were grandathered in, you know, so I’m trying to make them all uniform in size. Henzi: Okay, thank you. Caramagno: The lottery sign, is it 60 square feet? Petitioner: I don’t know for sure, I thought there was a variance on that sign as well. Caramagno: Scott, do you know? Kearfott: I don’t know how big the square feet signage is on that but I know we granted a variance for a much larger sign. Rite-Aid has 76 extra square feet. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 34 of 43 August 13, 2013 Caramagno: 76 feet additional? Kearfott: Yes. Caramagno: And two signs? Kearfott: Actually they’ve removed one of them, there’s only one excess sign now. Henzi: But we approved two. Kearfott: I believe you did. There were three at one time, but I believe it’s down to two, that’s what I read. Caramagno: We don’t have a picture of all the signs on the building for the purpose of how it would look in comparison, obviously you don’t want to give My Hobby and Toys a sign much larger than you say you give the Foodland or anything else? Petitioner: Indeed, indeed, that’s what I was trying to achieve is uniformity. Fisher: In further answer to your question, the variance that was granted for the lottery was not a 60 square foot sign because according to the minutes which hopefully you have in your packet, it was 40 square feet. Caramagno: Okay, thank you. Henzi: Anything else you’d like to say? Petitioner: No. Henzi: I’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the Board’s comments with Mr. Duggan. Duggan: You know I was initially hesitant to grant the signage but you being the owner coming to us, you’re trying to achieve uniformity with the whole strip mall there, in proportion to the other signs it’s even a little smaller so I will be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McCue. McCue: I agree just for consistency’s sake I think it would look very off to have a lot smaller sign to the other signs in the strip mall and it is, that strip is definitely set back a little bit further off of Plymouth Road than others so I will be in support. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: I’ve been in Livonia for fifty years and I remember Sheldon Center was one of the only shopping center that you could go to years ago and I’d like to see it continue. If there’s anything I dislike it’s driving by and seeing a great big void, nothing in it. And I don’t think that your petition for the sign is out of order at all, I think it would conform with the rest of the signs. And the other thing is the building, the space that we’re City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 35 of 43 August 13, 2013 looking at is in the center of all the rest of the building and with the new sign I think it will be easier to make out rather than one on the end or something like that so I will be in support. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: I will be in support for the reasons mentioned, that it will be esthetically pleasing, the size of the sign relative to the other signs to their frontages. I am delighted that you’re going to try and make a go of a new type of business in Livonia. I can’t think of any other existing independent toy or hobby stores. I think that signage is really important for that kind of a business and I’m delighted again to see that shopping center fill in, especially with something that will drive traffic, bring family, I think is great so I would have no objection to it. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. Caramagno: Well, I certainly would support as well. A sign needs to be effective, a sign that you can’t see from the road is no good. And because this building sits so far off of Plymouth Road, I think the variance is fair and I will be in support. Henzi: I agree as well with the comments that were already made, I would be in full support. So the floor is open for a motion. Upon motion by Sills, supported by RESOLVED: APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-35: Sheldon Center, LLC, 24255 13 Mile Road, Suite 220, Bingham Farms, MI 48025, on behalf of Lessee, My Hobby Place and Toys, 33201 Plymouth Road, Livonia, MI 48150 seeking to construct a wall sign upon a tenant space resulting in excess sign area. Wall Sign Area Allowed: 60 sq. ft. Proposed: 90 sq. ft. Excess: 30 sq. ft. The property is located on the south side of Plymouth (33201), between Farmington and Woodring, Lot No. 134-99-0003-004, C-2 Zoning District. Rejected by the Inspection Department under Zoning Ordinance 543, Section 18.50H(b)2 “Sign Regulations in C-1, C-2, C-3 and C-4 Districts,” be granted for the following reasons and findings of fact: 1. The uniqueness requirement is met because the business is filling vacant space and encouraging new business in Livonia and because of the depth of the shopping center frontage from Plymouth Road. 2. Denial of the variance would have severe consequences because there are many vacant spaces and the area is beginning to look like a ghost town, but this is a step in the right direction. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 36 of 43 August 13, 2013 3. The variance is fair in light of its effect on neighboring properties and in the spirit of the Zoning Ordinance because the businesses adjacent to Petitioner’s have the same size sign Petitioner is seeking a variance for. 4. The Board received no letters of approval and one (1) objection letter from neighboring property owners. 5. The property is classified as “General Commercial” in the Master Plan and the proposed variance is not inconsistent with that classification. FURTHER, This variance is granted with the following conditions: 1. That the sign not exceed the dimensions proposed. ROLL CALL VOTE: AYES: Sills, McCue, McIntyre, Duggan, Caramagno, Henzi NAYS: ABSENT: Pastor. Henzi: The variance is granted with that one condition, you cannot exceed the dimensions proposed. Petitioner: Understood. Henzi: Good luck. Petitioner: I thank you for your support. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 37 of 43 August 13, 2013 APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-36: Attilio Sylvestri, on the east side of Sarah (20690) between Eight Mile and Sarah Beth Lane, seeking to construct a single family dwelling resulting in deficient front yard setback. Henzi: Mr. Kearfott, anything to add to this case? Kearfott: Not at this time. Henzi: Any questions for Mr. Kearfott? Petitioner: My name is Attilio Sylvestri. Henzi: Hold on a sec. Scott, we approved several variances in this neighborhood. Kearfott: I’ve got them marked off. Henzi: Were any for front yard setbacks? Kearfott: Josie Court, 20689, front and rear yard deficient, granted 9.4 feet in the front yard. On Sarah, corner house, 20695, front yard deficiency granted. Sarah Beth, front yard deficiency, 10 feet. Laurel Court, front and rear yard granted, 8.85 feet in the front yard, and 34643 Sarah Beth, front yard deficiency of 10 feet granted. And there’s probably more, I didn’t go through the whole neighborhood, just the immediate area within 300 feet. Henzi: Thank you. Go ahead, please introduce yourselves. Petitioner: (Attilio) Frank Sylvestri, he’ll speak for me. Petitioner: (Frank) My name is Frank Sylvestri, my address is 51045 SundayDrive, Northville, 48167. And I’m helping my dad, I’m going to help him construct a home. His address is 18948 Gary Lane, Livonia. Henzi: Mr. Sylvestri, are you the builder? Petitioner: (Frank) I am a builder and he’s just going to --- he’s just going to build his own home but I’m going to help him. We’ve built in Livonia before. My brother and I have built Arbor Woods Condos on Ann Arbor Trail between Wayne and Newburgh, so we’re kind of familiar but it’s been a while since building in Livonia. Henzi: The way that I understand your application, you’re coming into that front yard deficiency because you had to bring the garage forward, is that basically it or am I wrong? Petitioner: (Frank) Yes. We thought that the lot was bigger. When he bought the lot, he was told it was 145 feet deep and it’s only 130. Henzi: Okay. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 38 of 43 August 13, 2013 Petitioner: (Frank) And the home is only 2200 square feet, he’s downsizing, but most of the houses in there are larger, they’re probably close to 3,000 average. So if those houses are fitting on there and I know a lot of them are colonials, the majority of them had to get front and back variances. Henzi: Okay. Can you tell us about the building materials? Petitioner: (Frank) It’s going to be all brick and limestone. Henzi: Any other questions. Duggan: Mr. Chair. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: Did the homeowners association turn down your proposal? Toloday: My name is Pete Toloday, I’m the president of the homeowners association. Duggan: All right, go ahead. Toloday: I’m at 20684 Sarah Road, I’m right next door to Mr. Sylvestri’s property. Part of the reason why I’m here tonight is because the board received a request form Mr. Sylvestri that we frankly weren’t --- didn’t completely understand the setback, where it was being measured from. We weren’t sure if the 40-foot setback was measured from the curb or from the sidewalk or wherever it was measured from, Mr. Kearfott and Ms. Murphy explained to me before the meeting started that it was 901 feet from the house side of the sidewalk, the house side of the sidewalk on the street, it’s ten feet from the curb so it would be about 45, 46 feet, the house would be 45, 46 feet off of the curb. The homeowners association when they read the letter thought that it was 35 feet off of the curb and that would be 15, 16 feet closer to the road than my home and we thought that would look unusual. So we were not going to approve this request. But given my new understanding that it’s measured from inside of the sidewalk, that would be 46 feet and that’s only 5 feet closer to the road than my home and I don’t have any issues with that. And the board did not have an issue with it as long as it was 40 feet off of the road. So it’s going to be 46 feet, we do not have a concern. Now you may see letters that say otherwise but I think that’s more attributable to not understanding the Zoning Ordinance. Henzi: Okay, thank you. While we’re at it, I suppose I’m going out of turn here, but I just want to nail this down because believe me having heard the variances that have come before us, we’ve wrestled with issues, I can’t tell you how many times, with respect to this subdivision. And were you aware before tonight that there have been many variances granted because folks have come to us and said I can’t build the type of house for this neighborhood on the size of lot that I’ve been given? Toloday: I was not previously aware that deviations had been approved, Mr. Sylvestri had pointed it out to me at a prior meeting that other people had shorter setbacks and I City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 39 of 43 August 13, 2013 understand the issue because of the lot size. Our bylaws mandate a certain size home, I mean Mr. Sylvestri’s home is going to be 2,200 square foot ranch, I’ve seen the plan, the minimum required is a 2,100 square foot ranch and so with a house that size it does not surprise me that a variance has been requested in the past. Henzi: And everyone is supposed to have a three-car garage and not everybody does? Toloday: Everybody is supposed to have a three-car garage, Mr. Sylvestri has a two and a half car garage. The board approved his request to do the two and a half car garage because there are other two car garages in that neighborhood, one of which is directly across the street from him. Henzi: I just want to feel you out because your predecessors had been here and strenulously objected at times and I wanted to let you know at least, this is my opinion, this is a neighborhood where the lots are not big enough for the types of homes that are mandated by the bylaws and that’s why we’re still have issues like today. Toloday: There’s been a bit of a rift in the neighborhood in the past, it doesn’t surprise me that the prior board would oppose them, deviations that were being requested. I’m newly elected, you know, and we’re trying to move forward. Personally I think it’s great that Mr. Sylvestri is building on the lot. We get a lot of car traffic in our neighborhood of people scoping out empty lots and I’ve got five kids, my kids are playing in the yard and there’s cars constantly coming in, we don’t have a thruway, cars are constantly coming through our neighborhood looking for empty lots and parking next to my yard, writing down phone numbers on signs, I think it’s great that this lot is going to be utilized and the house is being built. I’d love to see the neighborhood filled up. So I support this request. Henzi: And are you happy with this style? Because I mean this is a pretty nice looking house. Toloday: It’s a very nice looking house and we are supportive of it. It’s all brick and stone, it’s a little larger than the minimum required, it’s very attractively designed. Henzi: Thank you. And I apologize for going out of order, it’s just that we have such a history with this with the Board. Toloday: I’m not surprised. Henzi: You know, making objections, there’s a long history to this subdivision before any homes were built and that’s why I wanted to get some feedback and I appreciate that. Toloday: I appreciate your concern. Henzi: Any other questions? There’s nobody else in the audience, are there any letters? City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 40 of 43 August 13, 2013 Caramagno: Nazzareno and Adrian Troiani, approval, (letter read.), writes an approval from 34635 Sarah Beth Lane. An objection by Wendy Murray at 20693 Josie Court, (letter read). Josephine Slappey at 20698 Sarah Road, writes an objection, (letter read). Anthony Calo at 34643 Sarah Beth, writes an approval, and that’s all we’ve got. Toloday: If I may make a comment? Henzi: Sure. Toloday: The two individuals that submitted objections, Wendi Murray and Josephine Slappey, are fellow board members and again their objections resulted from our misunderstanding of where the setback are baselining from. Henzi: Okay, thank you. Gentlemen, anything that you’d like to say in closing? Petitioner: (Attilio) I’ve got four addresses, where they’re 33 feet from the garage. One is 33, one is 31, on is 25 and one is 32. So mine is 35. We’re talking about five feet, so no big deal. Henzi: Okay. Petitioner: (Attilio) I appreciate if you approve. Henzi: Okay. Thank you very much. I’ll close the public portion of the case and begin the board’s comments with Mrs. McCue. McCue: All things considered, everything that’s been discussed with the number of variances that have been approved in the neighborhood, the limited amount of variance that he’s going for, to me it makes a lot of sense and the style of the house is acceptable to that area, so I will support. Henzi: Mr. Sills. Sills: I’ll be in support. I don’t think 5-feet deviations is that much feet and we shouldn’t be so concerned about it in this particular subdivision. Henzi: Mrs. McIntyre. McIntyre: God bless people who take on subdivision board leadership roles, there are thankless jobs and then there are really thankless jobs, but you know, it’s a constant struggle and I think it kind of speaks to your neighborhood and spirit that you came here tonight to represent the board and explain their misunderstanding. There would be no reason that I can see to object to this. We’re getting a beautiful new home in Livonia, we’re getting a very nice subdivision and the people are working very hard to get a very desirable sub, they’re going to get a house that fits in terms of footprint, in terms of setback and everything else. Henzi: Mr. Caramagno. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 41 of 43 August 13, 2013 Caramagno: I’ll support your position. Henzi: Mr. Duggan. Duggan: Yes. I, too, will be in support. Henzi: I, too, will support it. I mean there’s no way I could object to this seeing as we’ve granted variances to similar petitioners in the past for exactly the same reason and it’s just not their fault. I mean the lots are a certain size and they’re building homes of a certain type and size required and they can’t do it without a variance so the floor is open for a motion. Upon motion by McIntyre, supported by Sills, it was: RESOLVED: APPEAL CASE NO. 2013-08-36: Attilio Silvestri, 18948 Gary Lane, Livonia, MI 48152, seeking to construct a single family dwelling resulting in deficient front yard setback. Front Yard Setback Required: 40. ft. Proposed: 35 ft. Deficient: 5 ft. The property is located on the east side of Sarah (20690), between Eight Mile and Sarah Beth Lane, Lot No. 014-08-0008-000, R-4 Zoning District. Rejected by the Inspection Department under Zoning Ordinance 543, Section 4.05 “Schedule of Minimum Front and Rear Yard Requirements in R-1 through R-5 Districts,” be granted for the following reasons and findings of fact: 1. The uniqueness requirement is met because of the size of the lot and other variances granted in the neighborhood. 2. Denial of the variance would have severe consequences for the Petitioner because it would force him to change all plans for the construction of the home. 3. The variance is fair in light of its effect on neighboring properties and in the spirit of the Zoning Ordinance because of the overwhelming number of similar variances granted in the same neighborhood. 4. The Board received two letters of approval and two objection letters from neighboring property owners. 5. The property is classified as “Low Density Residential” in the Master Plan and the proposed variance is not inconsistent with that classification. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 42 of 43 August 13, 2013 FURTHER, This variance is granted with the following conditions: 1. That it be built as presented. 2. That it be completed within nine months. 3. That once construction commences, that it be enclosed within 90 days. ROLL CALL VOTE: AYES: McIntyre, Sills, McCue, Duggan, Caramagno, Henzi NAYS: ABSENT: Pastor Henzi: The variance is granted with three conditions, you’ve got to build it as presented, it’s good for nine months which means you have nine months in which to complete it and then once construction commences, you’ve got ninety days to enclose it. Petitioner: (Frank) Thank you. Henzi: Good luck. Petitioner: (Attilio) Thank you very much, I appreciate it. City of Livonia, Zoning Board of Appeals Page 43 of 43 August 13, 2013 Motion by Duggan, supported by Caramagno, to approve the minutes of March 19, 2013 and April 23, 2013. _____________________________________________________________________ There being no further business to come before the Board, the meeting was adjourned at 9:00 p.m. _________________________ SAM CARAMAGNO, Secretary _________________________ MATTHEW HENZI, Chairman /bjm